1.20 Update was a complete missed opportunity

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Nathan88
We have GT7 with an 87% Metascore. User scores on the other hand are incredibly dubious.
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Are you honestly trying to claim that publishers and developers don't sit up and pay attention when a title gets review bombed? That they don't take changes to score seriously? That they don't investigate mismatches between reviewer and user scores?

That's what you're seriously claiming?

Do you actually think that Sony and PD didn't sit up and pay attention to the review bomb?


You also fail to mention that a factor in the backlash is because Sony and PD deliberately gamed the press review scores by hiding MTXs until after the press embargo had passed! Do you honestly think it would have the same 87% if they hadn't done so?
 
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Scaff
Are you honestly trying to claim that publishers and developers don't sit up and pay attention when a title gets review bombed? That they don't take changes to score seriously? That they don't investigate mismatches between reviewer and user scores?

That's what you're seriously claiming?

Do you actually think that Sony and PD didn't sit up and pay attention to the review bomb?
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27106ca69fbf8813f8f90535bb593cda.gif
 
MIE1992
We don't know if they'll add it later or not. Keep in mind that Gr.1 cars were in GT7 from launch, and it took a while to get an event based on them.
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They didn’t add Gr. 1 events. They added 950 PP events named Gr. 1. Basically they’re WTC950 in terms of format.

Boxster
While I also regret the lack of a good career mode and the lack of races with a good payout, it's definitely not game over after the menus.
I like the licences, missions and circuit experience, which combined keep you busy much longer than the menus which you can do in a few weeks.
And after that you have the online content, the time trial is fun and the daily races often enjoyable.
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Good for you that you enjoy doing licences as a post “campaign” activity, but they really shouldn’t be. In the older games it was a precondition to at least bronze all the license tests in order to finish the whole campaign. Those games (GT1 - GT4) had a sense of purpose in making progress beyond just collecting cars.

Voodoovaj
As a community we need to STOP SAYING THIS!!! Saying that the AI is "broken" or in some way needs to be "fixed" implies that it is not functioning as it is intended.

THE AI IS WORKING PERFECTLY. It is doing EXACTLY what PD intends for it to do. That intention is for it to be ULTRA easy.
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You mean ULTRA annoying. Some of the things the AI does doesn’t make it easier, such as when it decides to brake halfway into a corner. Players often get caught off guard by its recklessness, and I’ve lost many clean race bonuses because of this crap. It causes both collisions and panic moves forcing the car off the track. Maybe it is intentional, but it benefits no one.
 
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Scaff
Not the hot take you think it is, Expressway simply isn't a strong replacement for those circuits at all, hell Tokyo Expressway doesn't even make good use of the actual Tokyo Expressway (as the existence of the SRP mod for AC demonstrates, so many wasted layout opportunities, not to mention actual landmarks in the area).
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Even the 20 year-old Tokyo Xtreme Racer games on PS2/Dreamcast do a better representation than GT7.
 
Scaff
Are you honestly trying to claim that publishers and developers don't sit up and pay attention when a title gets review bombed? That they don't take changes to score seriously? That they don't investigate mismatches between reviewer and user scores?

That's what you're seriously claiming?

Do you actually think that Sony and PD didn't sit up and pay attention to the review bomb?
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Review bomb consisted of purposely negative reviews by the tantrum of many users due to the game economics.
That means those scores are neither serious scores nor serious reviews, just some negative punishment due to something users didnt like about it or some particular issue that needs to be fixed, no relationship whatsoever to the quality of the game itself. So... That automatically makes the metacritic user score a completely unreliable joke
 
RacingFan1
Review bomb consisted of purposely negative reviews by the tantrum of many users due to the game economics.
That means those scores are neither serious scores nor serious reviews, just some negative punishment due to something users didnt like about it or some particular issue that needs to be fixed, no relationship whatsoever to the quality of the game itself. So... That automatically makes the metacritic user score a completely unreliable joke
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That's a bit like claiming everyone who owns GT7 has a positive view of the game ... if you delete/ignore ignore the many reviews of people who are dissappointed with it ...

People buy games to enjoy, not to purposely get angry and waste time writing about it on the internet...

I hope Sony are paying you in roulette tickets and NSX rally cars for your relentless dogma on here.
 
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RacingFan1
Review bomb consisted of purposely negative reviews by the tantrum of many users due to the game economics.
That means those scores are neither serious scores nor serious reviews, just some negative punishment due to something users didnt like about it or some particular issue that needs to be fixed, no relationship whatsoever to the quality of the game itself. So... That automatically makes the metacritic user score a completely unreliable joke
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No.
It.
Does.
Not.


Once again you ignore the actual point for you own goalpost moving, nonsense.

You claimed they aren't taken seriously, PD took them seriously enough that it, in part, spurred Kaz to bother to engage with the players.
 
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RacingFan1
Review bomb consisted of purposely negative reviews by the tantrum of many users due to the game economics.
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Which happened in large part, among other things, due to Sony/PD hiding key details of the game economy and MTX setup from journalists during the pre-release campaign for GT7. Once people got their hands on the full retail game and realized how the economy, career and MTX structure really worked (and also realized that there was fully-functioning content cut before the release of the retail game, and certain advertised aspects of the game were nowhere to be found), people understandably started demanding answers as to why the product they spent $70-$100 for didn't meet expectations.

Instead of giving answers, PD went with their usual radio-silence strategy, which further exacerbated the already substantial frustration, and led to the review-bombing.
RacingFan1
So... That automatically makes the metacritic user score a completely unreliable joke
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Except that it isn't. The fact that Kaz responded to the negative feedback, and the implementation of the v1.11 update proves it. It doesn't matter how much you try and say otherwise, because Sony and PD themselves have proven you wrong.
 
Nielsen
You mean ULTRA annoying. Some of the things the AI does doesn’t make it easier, such as when it decides to brake halfway into a corner. Players often get caught off guard by its recklessness, and I’ve lost many clean race bonuses because of this crap. It causes both collisions and panic moves forcing the car off the track. Maybe it is intentional, but it benefits no one.
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Oh, it's 100% annoying, but we need to keep up THAT mantra. That it's annoying, that it's uninteresting, that it's frustrating, that it's simply a terrible experience. Those are terms aimed at the way it is implemented.

Saying that it's broken is a term aimed at the technical performance. For instance, as you point out, it brakes super early and even mid corner. If the coder goes and looks at the code and it says that this is the expected behaviour, then as far as they are concerned, it's not broken.
NotThePrez
Except that it isn't. The fact that Kaz responded to the negative feedback, and the implementation of the v1.11 update proves it. It doesn't matter how much you try and say otherwise, because Sony and PD themselves have proven you wrong.
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Scaff
No.
It.
Does.
Not.


Once again you ignore the actual point for you own goalpost moving, nonsense.

You claimed they aren't taken seriously, PD took them seriously enough that it, in part, spurred Kaz to bother to engage with the players.
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These guys get it.

Here's some shocking information; professional reviews are corrupt :) - I know this first hand. I have taken part in corrupting them. I have been in meetings where the score was given to the reviewer by the publisher. Yes, I said it, the review score was given to the reviewer prior to the reviewer writing the review.

Anyone who does not play along, doesn't get to review anything from that publisher anymore. This doesn't happen all the time, but it does happen.

Not to mention the obvious, that publishers and developers are people and they read the user scores as well. Sometimes they scoff, because it's easy to scoff at some of it, but when you get review bombed, people take notice. Now, obviously, profit takes precedence, but to think that user scores don't matter is grossly naïve
 
It may seem like semantics but I don't believe developers/publishers give a damn about a review bomb in itself. Its the negative press that follows that they have to be seen to reacting to. GT7 has / will sell millions. The opinions of around 7000 users aren't that important (other than making a few short term headlines).
 
NotThePrez
Which happened in large part, among other things, due to Sony/PD hiding key details of the game economy and MTX setup from journalists during the pre-release campaign for GT7. Once people got their hands on the full retail game and realized how the economy, career and MTX structure really worked (and also realized that there was fully-functioning content cut before the release of the retail game, and certain advertised aspects of the game were nowhere to be found), people understandably started demanding answers as to why the product they spent $70-$100 for didn't meet expectations.

Instead of giving answers, PD went with their usual radio-silence strategy, which further exacerbated the already substantial frustration, and led to the review-bombing.

Except that it isn't. The fact that Kaz responded to the negative feedback, and the implementation of the v1.11 update proves it. It doesn't matter how much you try and say otherwise, because Sony and PD themselves have proven you wrong.
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Scaff
No.
It.
Does.
Not.


Once again you ignore the actual point for you own goalpost moving, nonsense.

You claimed they aren't taken seriously, PD took them seriously enough that it, in part, spurred Kaz to bother to engage with the players.
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Proof they actually did all that due to the metacritic thing? Metacritic is far from being the only place in internet where you can manifest your dissatisfaction for a game.
Also people who have good memory remember that in GTS they did the same, it was all planned, there was no review bomb. First one or two versions were almost empty of in game money prizes (but had microtransactions since day 1!), then with the first few important updates they added a lot of stuff and many money prizes
 
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RacingFan1
Proof they actually did all that due to the metacritic thing? Metacritic is far from being the only place in internet where you can manifest your dissatisfaction for a game.
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Quote me saying they did it all due to Metacritic, oh and your moving the goalposts, again.
RacingFan1
Also people who have good memory remember that in GTS they did the same, it was all planned, there was no review bomb. First one or two versions were almost empty of in game money prizes (but had microtransactions since day 1!), then with the first few important updates they added a lot of stuff and many money prizes
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Your memory is failing you, GTS added microtransactions in 2018, not day 1.

kotaku.com

Gran Turismo Sport Gets Microtransactions A Year After Series Producer Said It Wouldn’t

Gran Turismo Sport’s July update is now live, adding a new race track and more cars. It’s also introduced microtransactions, something the series producer said last summer the game wouldn’t have.
kotaku.com kotaku.com
 
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Scaff
Quote me saying they did it all due to Metacritic, oh and your moving the goalposts, again.

Your memory is failing you, GTS added microtransactions in 2018, not day 1.

kotaku.com

Gran Turismo Sport Gets Microtransactions A Year After Series Producer Said It Wouldn’t

Gran Turismo Sport’s July update is now live, adding a new race track and more cars. It’s also introduced microtransactions, something the series producer said last summer the game wouldn’t have.
kotaku.com kotaku.com
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You said Kaz took the Metacritic thing seriously so they reacted.
Ok microtransactions were not there on day 1, my mistake, but in game money prizes were still very low at the start and they increase them. And they increased them a lot with updates.
 
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RacingFan1
You said Kaz took the Metacritic thing seriously so they reacted.
Ok microtransactions were not there on thay 1, my mistake, but in game money prizes were still very low at the start and they increase them. And they increased them a lot with updates.
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Read my post again, this time properly. And your own for that matter, as your failing to be consistent in that as well.
 
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Voodoovaj
Here's some shocking information; professional reviews are corrupt :) - I know this first hand. I have taken part in corrupting them. I have been in meetings where the score was given to the reviewer by the publisher. Yes, I said it, the review score was given to the reviewer prior to the reviewer writing the review.

Anyone who does not play along, doesn't get to review anything from that publisher anymore. This doesn't happen all the time, but it does happen.
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Maybe we're not professional enough, but we've never been told what score to give a title; hell, I didn't even score the review I posted today...

We've never even had any attempt to bribe - I've been sent three things after reviews (F1 2020 [which was a box with a t-shirt, flag, PC copy of the game, and the wrong name on the box], RIMS [LEGO Ducati], GT Sport [Press kit... yes, a press kit after the review, and I didn't even write the review]) but nothing before.

If it was to ever happen, I wouldn't review it.

However I am well aware that it was a pretty pervasive practice in the 1990s.
 
Voodoovaj
Oh, it's 100% annoying, but we need to keep up THAT mantra. That it's annoying, that it's uninteresting, that it's frustrating, that it's simply a terrible experience. Those are terms aimed at the way it is implemented.

Saying that it's broken is a term aimed at the technical performance. For instance, as you point out, it brakes super early and even mid corner. If the coder goes and looks at the code and it says that this is the expected behaviour, then as far as they are concerned, it's not broken.
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I wasn’t disagreeing with that. I was only saying that the AI is more than just easy by being super annoying.
 
Famine
Maybe we're not professional enough, but we've never been told what score to give a title; hell, I didn't even score the review I posted today...

We've never even had any attempt to bribe - I've been sent three things after reviews (F1 2020 [which was a box with a t-shirt, flag, PC copy of the game, and the wrong name on the box], RIMS [LEGO Ducati], GT Sport [Press kit... yes, a press kit after the review, and I didn't even write the review]) but nothing before.

If it was to ever happen, I wouldn't review it.

However I am well aware that it was a pretty pervasive practice in the 1990s.
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For sure it isn't everyone, and the manner varied. It was never a cash deal or something like that. It often got hitched onto a marketing deal. For instance, a publisher would basically say that no advertising for the title in question would occur if the site/reviewer didn't play along. It might even extend to 2 or three titles, or even a season of advertising, or, simply, the reviewer became persona non grata for future reviews.

I want to be clear, I am not in any way pointing fingers at people at GTP. I never witnessed any such thing in connection to you guys. but IGN, Gamespot, Edge...yep. I saw that. Yes, it was the 90's in some cases, but I saw it right up to 2012, when I got out of dev.

I don't want to name publishers outright, but the publishers I worked with focused heavily on metacritic and did their best to skew the reviews in their favour.
 
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RacingFan1
Those 5000 hours that you keep repeating is a useless number considering it will keep updating and bringing new events and probably new ways to earn quick money that you dont even know about so...
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You mean like how PD halved race payouts across the board in one of the first major updates to the game? And have done nothing else in the months since then except the Tokyo/Sardegna/Le Mans/Spa bandaid after players called them out on it?

Wait, no. That's not entirely correct. They have done something to address the economy: raise the LCD car prices by 10s of millions every 3 months.
 
We just don’t know what in thee hell they’re doing. A few people have kept mentioning about only one event at Monza. There’s no 458 Cup race. No Lamborghini Trofeo Cup. Not even an FT1500 event.
Scaff
No.
It.
Does.
Not.


Once again you ignore the actual point for you own goalpost moving, nonsense.

You claimed they aren't taken seriously, PD took them seriously enough that it, in part, spurred Kaz to bother to engage with the players.
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Word up. The man even typed, "Sorry"(probably not including the MTX, but hey). Damn shame.
 
NotThePrez
Which happened in large part, among other things, due to Sony/PD hiding key details of the game economy and MTX setup from journalists during the pre-release campaign for GT7. Once people got their hands on the full retail game and realized how the economy, career and MTX structure really worked (and also realized that there was fully-functioning content cut before the release of the retail game, and certain advertised aspects of the game were nowhere to be found), people understandably started demanding answers as to why the product they spent $70-$100 for didn't meet expectations.

Instead of giving answers, PD went with their usual radio-silence strategy, which further exacerbated the already substantial frustration, and led to the review-bombing.
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It's very important to remember that this also happened right after the update which took the servers down for over 30 hours and cut all the best paying race payouts. Right after release.

Reviewers got to play a version of the game with better race payouts and with the MTX prices hidden. Early players also got those better race payouts, and enough cafe content to make it unclear how little content there truly was. I was one of the people who was recommending GT7 on my second day of playing, because I hadn't finished yet and PD hadn't cut the payouts yet. And then I hit the end of the cafe, and I stopped recommending it. And then they cut the payouts and took down the servers, and I told everyone to avoid it entirely.

As a reminder, because I think it's very important to keep in mind, this was version 1.07, released March 17, just under 2 weeks after release:

Code: 
      World Touring Car 800:      24 Heures du Mans Racing Circuit:    5,000 Cr -> 70,000 Cr
      World Touring Car 800:      Monza Circuit:                       5,000 Cr -> 70,000 Cr
      World Rally Challenge:      Alsace Village:                     50,000 Cr -> 30,000 Cr
      Dirt Champions:             Fisherman's Ranch:                  65,000 Cr -> 30,000 Cr
      Dirt Champions:             Sardegna Windmills:                 65,000 Cr -> 40,000 Cr
      Dirt Champions:             Colorado Springs Lake:              65,000 Cr -> 40,000 Cr
      GT Cup Gr.4:                High Speed Ring:                    65,000 Cr -> 35,000 Cr
      GT Cup Gr.4:                Brands Hatch GP Circuit:            65,000 Cr -> 45,000 Cr
      GT Cup Gr.3:                Spa Francorchamps:                  75,000 Cr -> 50,000 Cr
      GT Cup Gr.3:                Suzuka Circuit:                     75,000 Cr -> 50,000 Cr
      GT Cup Gr.3:                Autodrome Lago Maggiore:            75,000 Cr -> 50,000 Cr
      Clubman Cup Plus:           High Speed Ring:                    35,000 Cr -> 25,000 Cr
      Clubman Cup Plus:           Tsukuba Circuit:                    35,000 Cr -> 25,000 Cr
      Clubman Cup Plus:           Goodwood:                           35,000 Cr -> 12,000 Cr
      American Clubman Cup 700:   Special Stage Route X:              30,000 Cr -> 15,000 Cr
      American FR Challenge 550:  Blue Moon Bay Speedway:             15,000 Cr -> 10,000 Cr
      American FR Challenge 550:  Weathertech Raceway Laguna Seca:    15,000 Cr -> 10,000 Cr
      American FR Challenge 550:  Willow Springs Raceway:             15,000 Cr -> 10,000 Cr

The only races that were increased were the obviously incorrect WTC 800 races.
 
Nathan88
GT7 has a Metacritic of 87% which makes it one of the highest rated titles of the year.
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87% stretches from 23rd to 34th as far as I can see. That's both pretty good, but also not something to brag too hard about. It's up there with Monster Hunter Rise, D2 Witch Queen and Spiderman Remastered.

By rating it's a decent game, but it was also reviewed before the reveal of microtransactions.
Nathan88
We have GT7 with an 87% Metascore. User scores on the other hand are incredibly dubious.
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Maybe. But Polyphony sure seemed to respond quicker when the review bomb was going on. We got statements from Kaz and everything.
 
Can I just bring this forward too? This is lifted straight from the Gran Turismo website about GT7

The Greatest Gran Turismo Experience​

The legendary ‘GT Mode’ makes a comeback as the ‘Campaign Mode’. Returning to the roots of the Gran Turismo experience, players will start from the GT World Map.

The name Gran Turismo stems from the great journeys taken by people in the 17th century, traveling on long routes throughout continental Europe where they would learn and grow. The Campaign Mode of GT7 will again be a place where players embark on unique journeys through the world of Gran Turismo, to create their own individual experiences.

So the GT mode never came back or Campaign Mode. I love how they claim that the Campaign mode will have players embarking on unique journeys to CREATE THEIR OWN INDIVIDUAL EXPERIENCES!

The most linear GT to date.
 
Scaff
Are you honestly trying to claim that publishers and developers don't sit up and pay attention when a title gets review bombed? That they don't take changes to score seriously? That they don't investigate mismatches between reviewer and user scores?

That's what you're seriously claiming?

Do you actually think that Sony and PD didn't sit up and pay attention to the review bomb?


You also fail to mention that a factor in the backlash is because Sony and PD deliberately gamed the press review scores by hiding MTXs until after the press embargo had passed! Do you honestly think it would have the same 87% if they hadn't done so?
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Agreed, the 87% metascore is bogus, this game with incremental updates of it slowly getting better deserves a 65% rating.

The fact that PD can pull this off means we are okay with ****** games that get released only to get better eventually. THAT should not be the case. Fanboys ruin series/games. If anything we should be harsh on PD, they've been at this since what, 97? I guess the positive thing is they drop the ball, someone or something will pick up and be the next best thing.
 
ScottPye20
Wouldn't it be great if you could actually do a "grand tour" in this game.
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That "grand tour"(GT5?) through Italy, was the closest we got. It was like a mille miglia, but we didn't actually drive to the destinations. So close.
 
05XR8
That "grand tour"(GT5?) through Italy, was the closest we got. It was like a mille miglia, but we didn't actually drive to the destinations. So close.
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A literal drive to those destinations would be a tall order. I think the best they could reasonably pull off would be a map tour with scape locations, which, in my opinion, would be a better use of the scapes feature. At least it would give some order to it.
 

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